158 replies to this topic

[Mack1]

Devs am not here to say I told you so but you really should listen to your more experienced gamers, we do know a lot better than you what will happen in games, we are the gamers, we know eachother a lot better than you lot do.

Your dreadful plan to stop PUG stomping and thus make the game more user friendly to new players has pretty much failed just as I predicted it would.

I told you that all the talk from premades and clans about how they had no choice but PUG stomp was utter bullcrap and that even when 8 v 8 options came into effect they would simply split into two 4 man lances and continue the stomp. This is exactly what is happening and I am quite sure you already know this from your DATA.

So here I will once again post you a simple solution to this, granted it's not as elaborate as your grand master plan but my plan is far better. Your plan reminded me of the French in WWII with the Maginot Line, it looks great but is very easy to defeat. So here it is, the best plan and only plan that will stop this.... (drum roll) Implement a solo only queue! Yup that's it, plain and simple, easy and effective. If you just want to solo against other soloists or just practice with your mech in fair and square games have a solo queue. You can still organise your team in game but it totally stops premades from destroying newbies.

If you want to play with a few m8's then you simply join the normal queue (the one we have now) and if you want to play against other premades we have the 8 v 8 queue. Everyone is happy (except the premades who can't actually play against other premades cos they suck.)

So there you go, you could have done this ages ago, i actually suggested this in beta, can't believe you ain't done it. But I can tell you now a lot of new players are not going to stick around getting facerolled by premades for very long.

[Vlad Ward]

This is dumb.

No one would join the "normal queue", leaving no one for 2 or 3 person teams to play with.

[bLaCkMaMbA]

Your plan makes no sense. Their solution already is an ELO matchmaking system which fixes all of this since it'll match people by ratings and thus similar levels. New players will play new players... advanced people will play advanced people. Why would they waste dev time delaying everything else just to make you your own little pug only playground when ELO helps everyone from new players to pugs to clans?

And again... stop making another boogeyman thinking all clans are splitting into 4+4's just to sync drop and pugstomp. It's a small minority and not too hard to live with until Phase 3 + ELO comes out. It's not like you're facing a sync dropped 8 man every single game.

Edited by bLaCkMaMbA, 11 December 2012 - 01:59 PM.

[Budor]

I would really like the game to "mark" grouped people ingame. Some sort of small icon to indicate that this player dropped with 1-3 others visible by enemies and friendlies alike.

Something along the lines of: I dropped with one other guy so both of us have a "2" besides our triangle.

Would help to focus fire, run from or stick with grouped people.

OT: Color coding for group members (all from your group have green triangles) would be a great option to...

Edited by Budor, 11 December 2012 - 01:59 PM.

[Mack1]

Budor, on 11 December 2012 - 01:55 PM, said:

I would really like the game to "mark" grouped people ingame. Some sort of small icon to indicate that this player dropped with 1-3 others visible by enemies and friendlies alike.

Something along the lines of: I dropped with one other guy so both of us have a "2" besides our triangle once targeted.

Would help to focus fire, run or stick with grouped people.

OT: Color coding for group members (all from your group have green triangles) would be a great option to...

I would love to see this and i bet the screens would be full of numbers.

bLaCkMaMbA, on 11 December 2012 - 01:47 PM, said:

Your plan makes no sense. Their solution already is an ELO matchmaking system which fixes all of this since it'll match people by ratings and thus similar levels. New players will play new players... advanced people will play advanced people. Why would they waste dev time delaying everything else just to make you your own little pug only playground when ELO helps everyone from new players to pugs to clans?

And again... stop making another boogeyman thinking all clans are splitting into 4+4's just to sync drop and pugstomp. It's a small minority and not too hard to live with until Phase 3 + ELO comes out. It's not like you're facing a sync dropped 8 man every single game.

I never said all clans

Edited by Mack1, 11 December 2012 - 01:59 PM.

[Pugastrius]

Here's the clean solution that doesn't increase wait times.

Simply match based on party size.
- Playing solo? then put a solo on the other side.
- 4 player group? Put a 4 player group on the other side.
- Have a group of 6? Put a 6 player group on the other side.

The one restriction would be a certain "wait time" such that if you couldn't find a 6 person group then the game would pull from the next highest that was immediately available (say a 5 or 4 + 2)

This solves all of the problems, and lets you queue with any number of people that they want.

The fact that this wasn't put into the game already is baffling.

Edited by Pugastrius, 11 December 2012 - 02:05 PM.

[bLaCkMaMbA]

Mack1, on 11 December 2012 - 01:59 PM, said:

I would love to see this and i bet the screens would be full of numbers.



I never said all clans

Just yesterday you claimed that the "majority" of clans are doing this with no numbers or evidence to support your claim. Just another effort on your part to make another boogeyman.

Edited by bLaCkMaMbA, 11 December 2012 - 02:07 PM.

[Wolfways]

Budor, on 11 December 2012 - 01:55 PM, said:

I would really like the game to "mark" grouped people ingame. Some sort of small icon to indicate that this player dropped with 1-3 others visible by enemies and friendlies alike.

Something along the lines of: I dropped with one other guy so both of us have a "2" besides our triangle.

Would help to focus fire, run from or stick with grouped people.

OT: Color coding for group members (all from your group have green triangles) would be a great option to...

Just change your teams blue triangle in the UI to green for those you're grouped with, and have full team data on a cockpit monitor.

[Mack1]

bLaCkMaMbA, on 11 December 2012 - 02:02 PM, said:

Just yesterday you said that the "majority" of clans are doing this with no numbers or evidence to support it. Just another effort on your part to make another boogeyman.

I totally believe the majority of clans are doing this but that does not mean ALL, there is a difference. I know a few people that actually are genuine 8 v 8 players and only pug when they can't find an 8 v 8 match and credit to them. But sadly the vast majority are just stomping as it's good for their W/L ratio, good xp and great C-bills. Sorry like but it's true.

Edited by Mack1, 11 December 2012 - 02:08 PM.

[Belorion]

Vlad Ward, on 11 December 2012 - 01:36 PM, said:

This is dumb.

No one would join the "normal queue", leaving no one for 2 or 3 person teams to play with.

2+2+2+2

2+3+3

2+2+4

5+3

6+2

7+1

...

[RumRunner151]

1) Your premise is flawed. The only time I see Cored drop w/ 4 or less is when we don't have enough for another full 8 so we group up with what we have.
2) Your attitude is not conducive to being taken seriously.
3) In spite of the above, I agree that a solo queue could be good.

Edited by RumRunner151, 11 December 2012 - 02:11 PM.

[bLaCkMaMbA]

Mack1, on 11 December 2012 - 02:07 PM, said:

I totally believe the majority of clans are doing this but that does not mean ALL, there is a difference. I know a few people that actually are genuine 8 v 8 players and only pug when they can't find an 8 v 8 match and credit to them. But sadly the vast majority are just stomping as it's good for their W/L ratio, good xp and great C-bills. Sorry like but it's true.

Thats why you're making another boogeyman out of this... you think that you're gettin stomped by premade 8 mans sync dropping over and over again yet you can't prove it with numbers or evidence. The common argument/evidence you and others are using is... "OMG they have ECM mechs and are working together!" which is laughable. It's like common tactics that good PUGs can also use.

Before you go around accusing the "majority of clans" of syncdropping to pug stomp... how bout you get some numbers to back up your claims. Go play 10-15 matches and see how many Sync dropped opponents you get with proof that they actually did sync drop. I bet you... just like the old premade boogeyman... the numbers are much smaller than you think. It's exactly how the premade boogeyman was debunked by devs and people taking screenshots/records over a span of games to really have facts on how bad the problem was.

Without facts/numbers... premades can do exactly what you're doing.... they can accuse you of wanting a PUG only queue so you won't have to face a larger pool of advanced players just so you could pugstomp.

This is exactly why the ELO system makes the most sense. People of specific skill level are only matched up against equivalent skill level... this way theres no more excuses of why you lose and no more of this advanced players stomping on new players.

Edited by bLaCkMaMbA, 11 December 2012 - 02:21 PM.

[Thorn Hallis]

Did I missed the announcement that Phase 2 was ment to prevent PUG-stomping?

[PANZERBUNNY]

Pug stomping will never end unless they make a daycare play mode.

[soarra]

Mack1, on 11 December 2012 - 02:07 PM, said:

I totally believe the majority of clans are doing this but that does not mean ALL, there is a difference. I know a few people that actually are genuine 8 v 8 players and only pug when they can't find an 8 v 8 match and credit to them. But sadly the vast majority are just stomping as it's good for their W/L ratio, good xp and great C-bills. Sorry like but it's true.

or they are a small group of 5-7 people who cant queue togethor

[Lin Shai]

PANZERBUNNY, on 11 December 2012 - 02:16 PM, said:

Pug stomping will never end unless they make a daycare play mode.

I've been saying for months they simply needed to add color coding to the drop screen where they show people's names as they join the match. In a group? Your name is green.

Then the bad PUGs who say they lose every match to the dreaded "pre-made" would know they're just getting beaten by other PUGs.

Edited by Lin Shai, 11 December 2012 - 02:20 PM.

[Locan Ravok]

Vlad Ward, on 11 December 2012 - 01:36 PM, said:

This is dumb.

No one would join the "normal queue", leaving no one for 2 or 3 person teams to play with.

If no one would join normal, does not it tell you something?

[Vlad Ward]

Locan Ravok, on 11 December 2012 - 02:23 PM, said:

If no one would join normal, does not it tell you something?

It tells me that the minute they do this, we'll see a thread complaining about people sync dropping 8 individuals into the pug-only queue to farm.

Because that's the only possible way they could have lost.

Deal with it for a month. Let ELO sort out the rest.

[Pando]

PANZERBUNNY, on 11 December 2012 - 02:16 PM, said:

Pug stomping will never end unless they make a daycare play mode.

Simply awesome.

OP, idea is dumb. Currently groups with greater than 4 less than 8 are forced to split and not play together.

bLaCkMaMbA, on 11 December 2012 - 02:11 PM, said:

Thats why you're making another boogeyman out of this... you think that you're gettin stomped by premade 8 mans sync dropping over and over again yet you can't prove it with numbers or evidence. The common argument/evidence you and others are using is... "OMG they have ECM mechs and are working together!" which is laughable. It's like common tactics that good PUGs can also use.

Before you go around accusing the "majority of clans" of syncdropping to pug stomp... how bout you get some numbers to back up your claims. Go play 10-15 matches and see how many Sync dropped opponents you get with proof that they actually did sync drop. I bet you... just like the old premade boogeyman... the numbers are much smaller than you think. It's exactly how the premade boogeyman was debunked by devs and people taking screenshots/records over a span of games to really have facts on how bad the problem was.

Without facts/numbers... premades can do exactly what you're doing.... they can accuse you of wanting a PUG only queue so you won't have to face a larger pool of advanced players just so you could pugstomp.

This is exactly why the ELO system makes the most sense. People of specific skill level are only matched up against equivalent skill level... this way theres no more excuses of why you lose and no more of this advanced players stomping on new players.

That's real easy to thwart too, dropping with the intention of lowing your score. Then, you pubstomp to HELL and back. Rinse and repeat.

[frostdillicus]

Your plan has been tried before by other games in a similar vein to MWO and in those games splitting up your population into separate queues when your player population is small will destroy a game.

8v8 matching is fine, but anything other than that will usually lead to horrendous wait times for any not solo queuing. Plus with tonnage matching, it makes things even worse.

No, the way to fix things is not to make a solo queue and a group queue. It doesn't work. Ask anyone who played Super Monday Night Combat. When they started messing with the queue system, it ended the game. NOBODY wants to wait 45 minutes for a single game.

Is there a way to fix that? I'll leave that up to others to discuss as I do not have any ideas on the matter. All I have to offer is experience with a game that died a slow death because of near constant messing with the queue system in an attempt to make it "fair" for everyone.